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Home: Video University Forums: Audio For Video:
Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR

 
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2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 16, 2008, 9:06 PM

Post #1 of 28 (3919 views)
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Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR Can't Post
I did some reading on the differences and I understand them but I still have a question. I bought the AT822 (an unbalanced stereo mic). If I plug it into the XLR on my camera, is it recording stereo into one channel or ?????

Getting the Marantz PMD620 tomorrow. Very excited!!



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


MLiebergot
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 4:33 AM

Post #2 of 28 (3904 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Congrats on the AT822 mic, it's a dandy.
The AT822 is a stereo mic, which means that it has 2 separate elements L/R.
If you use it on your camera you will need a XLR to XLR Y cable in order to record both channels of the mic, as it will not record mono. So you need 2 channels to record properly with the mic. If you only use one XLR cable, then it will only record from one side of the mic, I believe the left side.
You can use a XLR to 1/8 cable to plug teh AT822 into a 1/8 mic jack to record 2 channels of audio. I believe the AT822 comes with one. So if you want to record with the PMD620 and the AT822, just use the XLR to 1/8 stereo jack that came with it.
In Reply To
I did some reading on the differences and I understand them but I still have a question. I bought the AT822 (an unbalanced stereo mic). If I plug it into the XLR on my camera, is it recording stereo into one channel or ?????

Getting the Marantz PMD620 tomorrow. Very excited!!
Michael

Cameras: (3) Sony FX1, Canon HV20
Audio: Marantz PMD620, Edirol R44, ZoomH4N, ZoomH2, Sennhesier G2
Mics: Rode NT5, Rode NT3, Rode M3, Rode NTG2, Shure SM57, AT822
Software: Sony Vegas, Final Cut Studio
Computer: MAC BABY! MacPro, MacBook Pro


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 17, 2008, 3:00 PM

Post #3 of 28 (3880 views)
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Re: [MLiebergot] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
That makes sense. So if I wanted to record the L & R signal from the mic into my A1 it would use both of the XLR inputs with the XLR Y cable.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


Ron Priest
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 5:25 PM

Post #4 of 28 (3862 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Brian, are you planning on mounting that mic to your camera?
_____________________________
Ron Priest - Louisville KY
New Website/Blog
Live StudioCam


MLiebergot
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 5:30 PM

Post #5 of 28 (3860 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Yes that's correct.
And to answer Ron's question, if you are going to use it on your camera, it will work very well. <much better than a shotgun mic will.
Mark Foley used to use a AT825, which is virtually the same mic as the AT822 but phantom powered and slightly better response, and loved how it sounded on camera.

Michael

Cameras: (3) Sony FX1, Canon HV20
Audio: Marantz PMD620, Edirol R44, ZoomH4N, ZoomH2, Sennhesier G2
Mics: Rode NT5, Rode NT3, Rode M3, Rode NTG2, Shure SM57, AT822
Software: Sony Vegas, Final Cut Studio
Computer: MAC BABY! MacPro, MacBook Pro


fr0gm@n
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 5:39 PM

Post #6 of 28 (3858 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
If you don't have the XLR Y cable you can always plug it in via XLR to CH1 on the A1 and set the camera to split the audio to both channels. Not true stereo but you get both recorded in cam that way.


Shouldn't TV's Discovery Channel be on a different station every day?


frog blog


Brackish
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 6:26 PM

Post #7 of 28 (3839 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
So if I wanted to record the L & R signal from the mic into my A1 it would use both of the XLR inputs with the XLR Y cable.
2nd,

Be VERY careful when plugging that mic into your A1. Do not send
phantom power to that mic - you could fry it.

I had looked at that mic myself and wanted to occasionally
use it on my cam with XLR input, but the fact that it can't
handle phantom put me off to getting it. Yes, I could turn
phantom off to the XLRs but sometime, in the heat of the
moment at an event, if I accidentally still had the phantom
turned on when I plugged it in ... Frown



------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 17, 2008, 8:57 PM

Post #8 of 28 (3823 views)
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Re: [Ron Priest] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Not necessarily. I just like to know all my options. I have an Sennheiser ME64 for the camera. I plan on mainly using this with the Marantz PMD620 that I received today for string quartets and singers at weddings.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 17, 2008, 8:58 PM

Post #9 of 28 (3821 views)
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Re: [fr0gm@n] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Interesting. So then how does the import into the NLE. Does it just "blend" the L and R from the mic into one channel on the camera?



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 17, 2008, 8:59 PM

Post #10 of 28 (3819 views)
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Re: [Brackish] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Thanks. I have been checking. I don't plan on using this mic on the camera but I will file it away to check first.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


fr0gm@n
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 9:05 PM

Post #11 of 28 (3813 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
There is a little switch by the mic inputs that shows a CH1 over a CH1,CH2 switch. Set it to the CH1,CH2 and it will lay down both audio channels on the tapes so it imports like it was recorded in Stereo. Check page 48 in your A1 manual.


Shouldn't TV's Discovery Channel be on a different station every day?


frog blog


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 17, 2008, 9:11 PM

Post #12 of 28 (3812 views)
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Re: [fr0gm@n] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Oh yeah. Sorry. Misunderstood what you were saying. I have the manual memorized. Wink

I thought you were talking about a way to record both channels of the mic on one channel of the camera. I need both the XLR connection on the camera, hence this post.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


Ron Priest
Veteran


Apr 17, 2008, 9:11 PM

Post #13 of 28 (3812 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Well I have the AT825, very nice mic but you had better have a good sock mount if your going to use it on your camera, it's very sensitive to handling. Well the 825 is, and I understand it's the same mic except it will take a battery.
_____________________________
Ron Priest - Louisville KY
New Website/Blog
Live StudioCam


Mark Foley
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 12:30 AM

Post #14 of 28 (3789 views)
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Re: [Ron Priest] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Quote
but you had better have a good sock mount if your going to use it on your camera
Ron is correct...it is very sensitive to handling noises.

_________________________
Mark






2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 18, 2008, 5:50 AM

Post #15 of 28 (3776 views)
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Re: [Ron Priest] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Thanks for the tip. That is one of the few things I don't like about the A1s. The mic holder is pretty solid so the mic picks up a lot of the camera noises and vibrations. I have a Sennheiser Shock Mount that I bought with an ME66 a while ago. I will test it out and see how it works with the AT822.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


MLiebergot
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 6:42 AM

Post #16 of 28 (3767 views)
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Re: [fr0gm@n] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Phillip the only problem with this method is that you are only getting a signal from one of the mic elements and not both. So in a sense you are losing all of the sound from the other mics axis. If you did this, then you're better off using a mono mic as it would be a waste of the AT822 stereo capability on a camera. Stick to the XLR Y cable.
In Reply To
There is a little switch by the mic inputs that shows a CH1 over a CH1,CH2 switch. Set it to the CH1,CH2 and it will lay down both audio channels on the tapes so it imports like it was recorded in Stereo. Check page 48 in your A1 manual.
Michael

Cameras: (3) Sony FX1, Canon HV20
Audio: Marantz PMD620, Edirol R44, ZoomH4N, ZoomH2, Sennhesier G2
Mics: Rode NT5, Rode NT3, Rode M3, Rode NTG2, Shure SM57, AT822
Software: Sony Vegas, Final Cut Studio
Computer: MAC BABY! MacPro, MacBook Pro


Brackish
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 6:58 AM

Post #17 of 28 (3760 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
The mic holder is pretty solid so the mic picks up a lot of the camera noises and vibrations. I have a Sennheiser Shock Mount that I bought with an ME66 a while ago. I will test it out and see how it works
I've put a shock mount in the hot shoe and then stuck a mic inside
the shock mount. I've also used a bracket with the cam and this
bracket had a shoe on it and I put the shock and mic on the
bracket so that I could put something else in the cam's shoe.



------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"


MLiebergot
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 7:14 AM

Post #18 of 28 (3757 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Brian take a look at this product...
J-Rod Twin, it may look stupid but works great. I use it with my PD170's as well as FX1's (I modified my FX1's to take the Z1's mic mount on my FX1).

I mount my wireless receiver on the side hotshoe (I hate velcro) and have my mic mounted on top using the Beyer Dynamic EA86 mic mount shown. It works great and I get no handling noise from my mics. I also like the low profile of the EA86 and neatness of the overall mounting of the wireless and mic.
In Reply To
Thanks for the tip. That is one of the few things I don't like about the A1s. The mic holder is pretty solid so the mic picks up a lot of the camera noises and vibrations. I have a Sennheiser Shock Mount that I bought with an ME66 a while ago. I will test it out and see how it works with the AT822.
Michael

Cameras: (3) Sony FX1, Canon HV20
Audio: Marantz PMD620, Edirol R44, ZoomH4N, ZoomH2, Sennhesier G2
Mics: Rode NT5, Rode NT3, Rode M3, Rode NTG2, Shure SM57, AT822
Software: Sony Vegas, Final Cut Studio
Computer: MAC BABY! MacPro, MacBook Pro


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 18, 2008, 7:35 AM

Post #19 of 28 (3754 views)
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Re: [MLiebergot] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Phillip the only problem with this method is that you are only getting a signal from one of the mic elements and not both. So in a sense you are losing all of the sound from the other mics axis. If you did this, then you're better off using a mono mic as it would be a waste of the AT822 stereo capability on a camera. Stick to the XLR Y cable.
In Reply To
There is a little switch by the mic inputs that shows a CH1 over a CH1,CH2 switch. Set it to the CH1,CH2 and it will lay down both audio channels on the tapes so it imports like it was recorded in Stereo. Check page 48 in your A1 manual.
Actually the easiest way to do this would be to just use the cable supplied with the AT822 that has the 1/8" plug as the A1 can accept this connection.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


Mark Foley
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 7:43 AM

Post #20 of 28 (3752 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
So has your 620 arrived yet?
_________________________
Mark






fr0gm@n
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 8:46 AM

Post #21 of 28 (3740 views)
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Re: [MLiebergot] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Yea, I know all that stuff is true but frequently what you pick up with the stereo mic will sound very similar to just a mono mic split between channels. If noise is everywhere both mics are going to pick up the same sounds.

The Y cable is the best way though. I was just offering an alternative.


Shouldn't TV's Discovery Channel be on a different station every day?


frog blog


2ndMile
Enthusiast

Apr 18, 2008, 10:45 AM

Post #22 of 28 (3725 views)
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Re: [Mark Foley] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Sure did. I played with it some yesterday. Amazing little piece of kit.



Brian Morris
2ndMile Blog


Brackish
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 4:52 PM

Post #23 of 28 (3704 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
Actually the easiest way to do this would be to just use the cable supplied with the AT822 that has the 1/8" plug as the A1 can accept this connection.
That's sweet that it accepts both - never heard of that in a cam before.



------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"


Brackish
Veteran


Apr 18, 2008, 4:58 PM

Post #24 of 28 (3702 views)
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Re: [MLiebergot] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
have my mic mounted on top using the Beyer Dynamic EA86 mic mount ... I also like the low profile of the EA86
Yeah, the low-profile of the 86 sounds nice. My 8415 shock mount stands
up further off the cam but the height does come in handy occasionally
when I use the mic outdoors with a furry. The height lifts the
fur out of the view of the lens.



------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"


Mark Foley
Veteran


Apr 19, 2008, 2:58 AM

Post #25 of 28 (3656 views)
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Re: [2ndMile] Balanced vs. Unbalanced XLR [In reply to] Can't Post
Brian,
Now that you have entered the world of flash media recorders, here is an important tip: always reformat the card before any important recordings. Once you get the hang of the menu/presets with the 620, you'll really appreciate the unit more.
_________________________
Mark





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