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Home: Video University Forums: Sony DV and DVCAM Forum:
Reusing DVCAM tapes?

 
 


a-bear
Novice

Jul 14, 2004, 5:08 AM

Post #1 of 25 (9002 views)
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Reusing DVCAM tapes? Can't Post
I am building an archive of summer city footage.

I was thinking of reusing some DVCAM tapes in a PD-170 (3-4 times) after I have copied the footage to disk. Is it unwise to reuse DVCAM tapes in this manner?


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 14, 2004, 6:49 AM

Post #2 of 25 (8987 views)
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Re: [a-bear] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
In Reply To
I am building an archive of summer city footage.

I was thinking of reusing some DVCAM tapes in a PD-170 (3-4 times) after I have copied the footage to disk. Is it unwise to reuse DVCAM tapes in this manner?
Many of us re-use our DV and DVCam tapes regularly without any issue. I reuse each tape around 5 or 10 times before using them for edit masters for storage. Some folks think it is sacrilegious to reuse a tape.


a-bear
Novice

Jul 14, 2004, 10:34 AM

Post #3 of 25 (8973 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Thx! Then I am not WAY out of line! Wink


VIDY
Novice

Jul 15, 2004, 10:07 AM

Post #4 of 25 (8939 views)
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Re: [a-bear] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Reusing tapes even if they are DVcam tapes is not a good idea. Using used tapes (DVcam or not) would actually shorten the life of your video head. There are many reasons why this happen:

* Contaminants get inside the tape path and the tape itself. These contaminants, i.e. particles of dust, particles of the tape itself, particles that fall on the head itself, actually are abrassive over the long run and specially if you do not clean the heads often will adhere to the drum heads and shorten its life.

* DVcam tapes are made of metal evaporated formulation. After a number of passes, there are some particles of the formulation which fall off from the tape and create minuscule gaps in the tape. Since the DVcam format uses a powerful correction and redundant process, you may not see any drop-outs, however those gaps exists. Where there are gaps, the polymer which holds the tape formulation can get exposed and this can act like sand paper to your heads.

I have friends that cannot figure out why they suddenly start to hear drop-outs which cannot be corrected with cleaning. The first thing I ask: Have you been reusing tapes? The answer is many times affirmartive. And unfortunetely, they have to replace the drums to solve the problem.

So, I would say the following. Only in cases of emergency, reuse tapes. You are definitely shortening the life of the drum by reusing tapes. There is no question about that.

The rule of thumb is: The more you reuse a tape, the more it becomes abrassive to the heads.


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 15, 2004, 6:34 PM

Post #5 of 25 (8920 views)
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Re: [VIDY] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
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Reusing tapes even if they are DVcam tapes is not a good idea. Using used tapes (DVcam or not) would actually shorten the life of your video head. There are many reasons why this happen:
(SNIP)
The rule of thumb is: The more you reuse a tape, the more it becomes abrassive to the heads.
What a load of baloney !! That load bears no resemblance to real life. Don't believe a word of it.


a-bear
Novice

Jul 15, 2004, 11:45 PM

Post #6 of 25 (8909 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
I was thinking about the 2" multi channel tape we used in the studio 25 years ago. They usually where used for about 10 recording at hight speed (don’t remember the speed after being digital so long). For every recording that tape was winded back and forth for retakes. Anyway as I remember after that it didn't look good.

I think I am going to be safe with 4-5 times use but I'll keep it to just that.

Well this is one of those subject I whish that some tape and cam company ha done a proper research on. Even Sony can't say...

http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Professional/markets/production/productsite/dvcam/mediaFAQs.html

Quote:

What is the number of times a single DVCAM tape can be recorded on (number of passes)?

It is difficult to state the number of passes that any media will withstand because the answer depends on many factors. For example:

Environmental conditions
VTR condition
Contamination
Handling
Storage

Under proper care, handling, maintenance and storage, many passes can be achieved.

End quote.

Well then it’s settle. You can use them many times.

Now we just have to find out what number “many” equals. Crazy


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 16, 2004, 6:53 AM

Post #7 of 25 (8893 views)
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Re: [a-bear] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Early in the days of DV a Sony Mini DV tape Was re-recorded on for 100 passes without a single dropout noted.
I would not want to reuse DV tapes for that many passes but "many" I would think, can be interpeted to a few dozen. I personally reuse DV/DVCam tape stock for approxamately 5 record cycles and then use them to hold editmasters for storage. YMMV


VIDY
Novice

Jul 16, 2004, 8:44 AM

Post #8 of 25 (8882 views)
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Re: [a-bear] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Even on those early days, I remember our technicians recommendation not to reuse tapes. They do cause a problem.


VIDY
Novice

Jul 16, 2004, 8:59 AM

Post #9 of 25 (8883 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Nobody is arguing about the dropout problems. Re-read my posting. DVcam has a powerful correction method as I said that is why you don't see any drop outs. They actually exist, however, you do not see it because of the algorithmic compensation. In othwer words, your deck "fill in the blanks" where it is supposed to be a drop-out. Capisci ? One of the worst formats in that regard, is actually Betacam SP. The format has dropouts every 2 seconds, however, you seldom see them because of the powerful correction method of the BVW decks. But thats a different story. The problem with reusing tapes is not the diminished perfomance of the tapes but the actual reduction of life of your heads, which means, you will have to change upper and lower drums earlier than usual.

DVcam tapes are abrasive because of the metal evaporated formulation they contain. The 2" tapes you are talking about contained a ferrous oxide formulation which tend to make the heads dirtier in the long run and more prone to cleaning but are less abrasive than metal evaporated.

Take my advice if you do not want problems in the long run. Do not re-use those DVcam tapes unless you have to absolutely do it. I have been in this business too long and have seen all sorts of cases. And don't use just your personal experience to derive to a broader conclusion.

In any case re-using tapes have always been a wrong proposition. Nobody does it in the professional work, you shoot DVcam, DigiBeta, DVCpro50, HDcam, always use brand new tape if you want to avoid problems. Tape is not to be reused.


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 16, 2004, 10:04 AM

Post #10 of 25 (8867 views)
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Re: [VIDY] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post

In Reply To



Take my advice if you do not want problems in the long run. Do not re-use those DVcam tapes unless you have to absolutely do it. I have been in this business too long and have seen all sorts of cases. And don't use just your personal experience to derive to a broader conclusion.

In any case re-using tapes have always been a wrong proposition. Nobody does it in the professional work, you shoot DVcam, DigiBeta, DVCpro50, HDcam, always use brand new tape if you want to avoid problems. Tape is not to be reused.
"Nobody does it in the professional work" That is most definitely NOT TRUE and insulting to the majority of pros that do. You are clueless and grossly inexperienced in DV video! DV and DVCam tape was never intended to be a one-use media. It is very robust and intended for and capable of many passes. You statement about reusing DV tape accelerates wear is just NOT TURE. No credible source has ever claimed that about DV tape. Re-use has never been a “wrong proposition” quite the contrary. Thousands of professionals re-use DV/DVCam tape every day and have been since 1995 – me included.


VIDY
Novice

Jul 16, 2004, 11:34 AM

Post #11 of 25 (8849 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Insulting the majority of the pros. You do not seem quite objective in your comments including calling me inexperienced in DV video. That's funny, I am the one thinking that your are quite inexperienced in video, period, regardless of what you claim to be.

Also, are you the one selling re-used DVcam tapes? If so, I would understand why you defend so much the issue. Professionals, specially in the high end side of the video production field do not re-use tapes. Believe me.
If you want to continue this lively debate which you started, I have no problem doing so.

But it does not take a genius to figure out that re-using tapes, DVcam or not, is a wrong proposition. You are contaminating the heads a lot quicker when you put a used tape in there. Particles of dust, particles of tapes, metal evaporated particles get easier in those heads and make them more susceptible to all sorts of problems and it DOES reduce its life which is usually rated at around 1,500-1,700 hours.

Maybe you are too slow in your event video business, that's why you are trying to save some money. In the long run, it is gonna cost you, baby.

Believe me, it is not a good idea to reuse tapes.




"Nobody does it in the professional work" That is most definitely NOT TRUE and insulting to the majority of pros that do. You are clueless and grossly inexperienced in DV video! DV and DVCam tape was never intended to be a one-use media. It is very robust and intended for and capable of many passes. You statement about reusing DV tape accelerates wear is just NOT TURE. No credible source has ever claimed that about DV tape. Re-use has never been a “wrong proposition” quite the contrary. Thousands of professionals re-use DV/DVCam tape every day and have been since 1995 – me included.


VIDY
Novice

Jul 16, 2004, 11:53 AM

Post #12 of 25 (8843 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
And I would not trust the advice of a manufacturer specially Sony which is known to have been incorrect in a number of issues in the past.

Do not reuse DVcam tapes, or any tapes, if you want to avoid problems in the long run. Trust me. Most video engineers and technicians would agree with that.


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 16, 2004, 2:47 PM

Post #13 of 25 (8831 views)
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Re: [VIDY] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
 
>>”Also, are you the one selling re-used DVcam tapes? “<<

No, why do you have some to sell? I would be very interested!

>>”But it does not take a genius to figure out that re-using tapes, DVcam or not, is a wrong proposition”<<

I guess it must because the only support for your “damage” position is your repeated ‘believe me’ and ‘trust me’ without a single reference to any credible source. As is frequently the case when someone says “trust me,” don’t believe it without checking further.

>>”Maybe you are too slow in your event video business, that's why you are trying to save some money. In the long run, it is gonna cost you, baby.”<<

I sold over 600 DVDs and a load of VHS tapes plus some pro bono work last month in my event video business, how’d you do? It ain’t “gonna cost you, baby” it saves me, in fact I’ll bet I have saved more in tape savings than you make in a single year. (no way of knowing, of course, just a boast of the thousands of $ I have saved reusing tape) As I have said before – used tape is less problematic and safer as it has already been QC’ed in a real life situation. A bad new tape never gets a second chance.

>>” And I would not trust the advice of a manufacturer specially Sony which is known to have been incorrect in a number of issues in the past.’<<

Now I see, you are a ‘conspirator theorist’ Sony, Panasonic, Microsoft, Ford and Chevy should not trusted because they are successful!

To try to conclude this exchange – I could care less if you never reuse your tapes or your tires and put new ones on each time you start the car. It makes no difference to me at all. Whatever you are comfortable with is fine. I recently bought a couple hundred one-pass Sony Excellence tapes; I looked them over carefully before using, but saved about 6 bucks per tape over new. I have been re-using DV tapes since 1995 when they were very scarce and hard to come by and will continue to as it makes very good sense for me.
It is very wrong of you to state things that are patently untrue to try to persuade folks to your point of view. I don’t know if you are new to video but you certainly are new to the internet, as this issue has been hashed and rehashed a thousand times before on every video forum and newsgroup, including the pay to join professional only groups. No one has ever claimed the “damage your heads” crap before on any post I have ever read. Please don’t claim your ‘opinion’ is fact backed up by “engineers and technicians” because it just isn’t so. It is unfair to the readers to let your ego cause you to state untruths to try to back up your ‘opinion’ -‘trust me!’ Crazy


Stoney
User


Jul 16, 2004, 6:47 PM

Post #14 of 25 (8828 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
As someone that has been in the video business for 15 years, I would say that you are both wrong and right. Many television news operations reuse tape quite a bit, on the other side, most commercial production houses will not reuse tape unless it is for back-up type purposes. The engineer where I work told me once that VHS was originally designed to be reused upto 100 times. I wouldn't want to try that. My opinion is that it depends on what your project is. I've only have a couple of tapes mess up on me after being reused. I will usually reuse tapes twice and then the third time I will use the tapes for either a master back-up or for my personal home taping. If I am doing a wedding, I usually try to put new tapes on the main camera, and then reused tapes on the secondary camera. It's just something I am more comfortable with. I don't think either one of you are full of crap or anyless professional as the other. Opinions are opinions, and facts very. Take the DVD-R vs. +R debate as an example. Do what is good for you and your clients.

Cheers
Stoney
LE 6.1, DVC-80, GL-1 & TRV900


VIDY
Novice

Jul 16, 2004, 7:51 PM

Post #15 of 25 (8820 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
   
Everyone knows about you Bobby (ANDYSCAM) . I have heard stories about you before.

You just don't know to accept other's opinions. Even if I was wrong (however I am sure I am not on this one) you should not write in that tone from the start.

You are probably reusing tapes and shortening those heads which usually should last a lot longer and you probably don't even know it.

And now I know in which line of business you are and I understand why you reuse tapes. I guess your standards are quite low, that's why. Don't be so greedy, you may think you are saving money but in the long run you are losing. I would never ever buy any used equipment from you knowing how you treat your equipment.

You can spend writing lengthy replies and you are still not making the point.

So people who want to be reckless with their equipment and work, follow Bobby's advice. Otherwise, do not reuse DVcam/DV tapes. It is just not worth it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


VIDY
Novice

Jul 16, 2004, 7:56 PM

Post #16 of 25 (8819 views)
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Re: [Stoney] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Thank you Stoney. At least your tone is positive unlike that of Bobby. And I am glad that you are using only brand brand new tape on the main camera.

As someone that has been in the video business for 15 years, I would say that you are both wrong and right. Many television news operations reuse tape quite a bit, on the other side, most commercial production houses will not reuse tape unless it is for back-up type purposes. The engineer where I work told me once that VHS was originally designed to be reused upto 100 times. I wouldn't want to try that. My opinion is that it depends on what your project is. I've only have a couple of tapes mess up on me after being reused. I will usually reuse tapes twice and then the third time I will use the tapes for either a master back-up or for my personal home taping. If I am doing a wedding, I usually try to put new tapes on the main camera, and then reused tapes on the secondary camera. It's just something I am more comfortable with. I don't think either one of you are full of crap or anyless professional as the other. Opinions are opinions, and facts very. Take the DVD-R vs. +R debate as an example. Do what is good for you and your clients.

Cheers


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 17, 2004, 7:21 AM

Post #17 of 25 (8807 views)
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Re: [VIDY] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
>>Everyone knows about you Bobby (ANDYSCAM) . I have heard stories about you before. <<

Then you and “everybody” knows I don’t waste time trying to sell erroneous theories! You have repeatedly claimed that reusing DV tape damages cameras but cannot put forth a single credible source to back you up. All your proof consists of is: “Trust Me” For the majority of DV users, reusing DV tape has been the norm since DV came to be in 1995. A lot of folks, like you, don’t do it, which is fine. No one cares which side of the issue you support, but lying to try to support your side for your ego's sake is wrong and grossly unfair to the folks that look to forums like this for answers.

>>You are probably reusing tapes and shortening those heads which usually should last a lot longer and you probably don't even know it.<<

If my economy is your concern, thank you, but consider this: I have about 100 DVCam 184s that have been reused about 4 times each. They started costing $50.00 each and have come down to $30.00 each over the years, so the 300 reuses of just thase tapes has saved about $12000, (yes that’s twelve thousand US dollars) in new tape cost in just one camera. (I have 4 full size DVCam cameras) If You were correct, that the reuse of tape accelerated wear, then I am still at least $11,000 ahead on each camera even after replacing every part in the camera, including heads, that touches the tape. And NO FULL SIZE CAMERA HAS NEEDED HEAD REPLACEMENT YET! I did have to replace the heads in 2 of my VX1000s in 1996 because of switching back and forth between Panasonic DV tape and Sony DV tape, as neither brand was plentiful enough to just use one and no one knew better then. So I also bristle when some newbie claims that the tape brand-swapping problem is just a myth or ‘urban legend’ "trust me"

>>And now I know in which line of business you are and I understand why you reuse tapes. I guess your standards are quite low, that's why. <<

You haven’t a clue about my video business but email me off list and I will send you some credits. Let me just say that I am the national videographer for United States Model, Talent America, and a handful of other national clients. Why you “guess” that my “standards are quite low” is truly puzzling…. Have you given up on your point and moved on to personal insults only??

>>Don't be so greedy, you may think you are saving money but in the long run you are losing.<<

Not true, See above….

>> I would never ever buy any used equipment from you knowing how you treat your equipment. <<


Ouch, you sure know how to hurt a guy! Unsure

>>So people who want to be reckless with their equipment and work, follow Bobby's advice. Otherwise, do not reuse DVcam/DV tapes. It is just not worth it !!!!!!!!!<<

Or those that would like to save enough on reuing tape to buy 2 brand new cameras when the first one needs service.
Mr. Vidy - take your last shot at me and then we will move on to the next issue - fair enough?


VIDY
Novice

Jul 17, 2004, 9:54 AM

Post #18 of 25 (8800 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
I know that you buy and sell used equipment and some accessories. Are you still selling the DA-1 converters or whatever the name is? You think I don't know about your dealings? How about used tape stock? And I know you are even in search for broken Digital 8 equipment. I have read your posts. I know how you probably got your DVcam cameras, all broken perhaps. Is that why you encourage people to reuse tapes so you can get them cheaper ????

In my case, I have seen several cases of people with all sorts of problems arising for the misuse (reuse) of DV and DVcam tape stock. People reporting audio drops stemming from broken heads as a result of used tapes. A good friend of mine who does weddings exclusively had 2 DVcam cameras and 1 DSR-11 deck. All of his cameras needed a head replacement. When the technician in Georgia tried to figure out how he could get his equipment is such a state, he found out the problem was the reuse of tape stock. He was reusing Sony Excellence tapes and DVcam tapes in all his units.

The technician said this is a NO-NO. You can transfer easily abrasive pollutants, contaminants, minute pieces of debris to the capstan, pinch roller and head which can dramatically decrease head life or cause a sudden problem. He even were to suggest to load the tape in your camera as fast as you can without leaving the compartment open since dust and other stuff can get in there.

Mr. Bobby, it seems that you fail to understand that these small heads are not designed to sustain heavy wear and tear. These are very small drums which need to be understood in order to avoid problems.

Was his case an isolated one? NO ... In my many years of business I have seen problem resulting from this reuse of tapes. How many people just on this board tend to report audio dropouts and glitches looking for a cure ? I have seen many ? Ask those people if they reuse tapes? And the answer is YES in many cases.

Do not reuse tape stock unless you are in an emergency. And any new project, always use BRAND NEW TAPE. You will sorry if you do not follow this advice.

Bobby, I will be here refuting your lies as many times as it takes. (How's the weather in the East Coast ? ;-)


Bob A
Veteran


Jul 17, 2004, 6:13 PM

Post #19 of 25 (8791 views)
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My final post on this thread [In reply to] Can't Post
>>I know that you buy and sell used equipment and some accessories. Are you still selling the DA-1 converters or whatever the name is? You think I don't know about your dealings? How about used tape stock? And I know you are even in search for broken Digital 8 equipment. I have read your posts. <<

Well, well I stand corrected you have been around the ‘net for a while. Thanks for asking but, No, I stopped selling the Sony DVMC–DA1 and DA2 Digital converters when the VX2000 and several consumer cams came out with analog inputs making them not needed anymore. They were a valuable accessory for the VX1000 at the time. Now, the only real oddball I sell is the Sony RM-95 wired LANC service tool and remote. The huge market for them has been overseas. Especially when the European VX1000 did not allow DV-In that could be overcome with reprogramming via the RM-95. That market has slowed considerably also. I never sold a used piece of DV tape but have bought a lot of it. The ‘broken’ D-8 unit I am looking for is for a business associate (an FBI trained and certified forensic video analyst) that only needs the playback ability for D-8 tape analysis and enhancement. We often share our equipment, skills and resources as needed. He does not have time to cruise the net much himself.

>> I know how you probably got your DVcam cameras, all broken perhaps. Is that why you encourage people to reuse tapes so you can get them cheaper ????<<

Sorry, all my DVCam cameras are in perfect working order. Maintenance and upkeep on equipment is just another part of the business. Not to do so is inviting disaster. Never replaced heads in any DVCam equipment (including 4 full size decks)

>>In my case, I have seen several cases of people with all sorts of problems arising for the misuse (reuse) of DV and DVcam tape stock. People reporting audio drops stemming from broken heads as a result of used tapes. A good friend of mine who does weddings exclusively had 2 DVcam cameras and 1 DSR-11 deck. All of his cameras needed a head replacement. When the technician in Georgia tried to figure out how he could get his equipment is such a state, he found out the problem was the reuse of tape stock. He was reusing Sony Excellence tapes and DVcam tapes in all his units.<<

I can accept the fact that all your acquaintances that reuse tape have had camera failures if you can accept the fact that no one I know in the business (from feature length DV movie makers to Uncle Charlie) has ever had a cam problem that could ever be even remotely related to re-use of DV tape – fair enough? Also, in reading hundreds of articles and posts about reuse of DV tape no one has ever (except you) claimed accelerated wear from the practice. If you have a written an example, please share it with us – not just another “trust me” statement.

>>The technician said this is a NO-NO. You can transfer easily abrasive pollutants, contaminants, minute pieces of debris to the capstan, pinch roller and head which can dramatically decrease head life or cause a sudden problem. He even were to suggest to load the tape in your camera as fast as you can without leaving the compartment open since dust and other stuff can get in there. <<

I am happy you are so enthralled with the single opinion of a single tech from Georgia. Did he also say “trust me” by chance?

>>Mr. Bobby, it seems that you fail to understand that these small heads are not designed to sustain heavy wear and tear. These are very small drums which need to be understood in order to avoid problems.<<

Actually I have a far better understanding than you give me credit for. I was a military trained lead Electronics Technician, solely responsible for the proper operation of over 100 different pieces of critical military electronics equipment during the Cuban Conflict and the Vietnam War. (yes, I am a very old dog) I have tried to keep somewhat up on current technology, but must admit I am somewhat in the dust now as to cutting edge stuff. I do have a pretty good understanding of modern DV cameras. I even own some Sony service manuals.

>>Was his case an isolated one? NO ... In my many years of business I have seen problem resulting from this reuse of tapes. How many people just on this board tend to report audio dropouts and glitches looking for a cure ? I have seen many ? Ask those people if they reuse tapes? And the answer is YES in many cases.
Do not reuse tape stock unless you are in an emergency. And any new project, always use BRAND NEW TAPE. You will sorry if you do not follow this advice.
Bobby, I will be here refuting your lies as many times as it takes. (How's the weather in the East Coast ? ;-)<<

Not just the East Coast but exactly 20 miles due west of Boston (extra points for you if you can read a map) pretty warm and humid here today. Send me a private email and I will send you address, phone #, GPS coordinates and color of my house and Kids names.
Tell you what, I won't force anyone to reuse a DV tape if you will stop making up stories that their camera will die if they do. Too much history refutes that position. If you believe I have EVER lied in ANY post anywhere on the net, bring the proof and I will burn my computer and never be heard from again. I have spent my life trying to be as honest as I could, I am no saint, but have tried very hard to be honest.
THE END OF MY PARTICIPATION IN THIS THREAD.
If you chose to continue, at have the b*lls to use a little more than 'VIDY' so we can take a look at your Internet history and see what you have been up to also.



VIDY
Novice

Jul 17, 2004, 8:07 PM

Post #20 of 25 (8779 views)
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Re: [VIDY] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Believe it or not, i know more about you than what you would imagine. And knowing you i know that you would continue this thread. But so I will.

You are not what you claim to be, neither a video engineer. I have been in this board for quite a long time since the early days of the VX1000.

You are just full of b/s from day 1 .

I would ask anyone not to trust what Mr. Bobby is saying. You have always claimed things that are not quite true. And i do not want to refresh your memory about different issues which at the end proof you were wrong in the past.

I would ask people not to reuse tapes, DV/DVcam, etc., because it is a sure way to create problems in the long run, sometimes right away.

It is just not worth it. If you want to have a camera you can trust, avoid the use of recycled DV/DVcam tapes.

And I can clearly see that this guy is mostly dedicated to prosumer equipment (Hi8, Digital 8, DA-1 adapters, early VX1000s) so unfortunately his level of expertise is quite limited.

Do as the professionals, use only brand new tape stock. You can't go wrong that way.

(Now, Mr. Bobby Andycam, your turn .... )
In Reply To
In Reply To
In Reply To


Anaconda281
New User

Aug 29, 2005, 2:27 PM

Post #21 of 25 (7486 views)
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Re: [VIDY] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
I agree with Vidy. You get paid enough to spend on new tape stocks on each job. I'd rather buy new tapes every weddings than risking it and have the clients after my behind to save a couple bucks. Even on new tapestock, I still don't feel safe and thinking of a dual HD/tape solution in case one day the DV deck gone mad and eats the tape while rewinding.


(This post was edited by Anaconda281 on Aug 29, 2005, 2:28 PM)


Bob A
Veteran


Aug 29, 2005, 4:28 PM

Post #22 of 25 (7466 views)
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Re: [Anaconda281] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Egads! I can't believe someone has dredged up this old thread!!!
A couple of notes on the thread if anyone is remotely interested:
I just did have the heads replaced on one of my full sized DV decks by Sony this month. It had a mere 3000 hours record time on it, about double what that jerk “VIDY” claimed a deck should get, in spite of mostly all of the masters created on it were multi pass (used) DVCam tapes.
Strangely my nemesis, VIDY has not been heard from at all this year on VU, he seems to have left with tail between his legs.
Also strangely the new poster, Anaconda281, this is his only post on VU, hmm.., the plot thickens!! Could this be a reincarnation……..


Tim
Enthusiast


Aug 30, 2005, 6:29 AM

Post #23 of 25 (7446 views)
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Re: [Bob A] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
    Memeories, I remember this thoughtful exchange from last summer. It reminds me of one last May when Bob and Redexit had a fun one. Come to think of it....Red never showed up again either. I believe this, reuse tapes if you want, if you keep your equipment clean and don't cross brands regularly you'll be fine. Use common sense. Bob you're scarring the newbies away Wink





VU Minnesota Crew

Well, I'm the best there is. Plain and simple, when I wake up in the morning I piss excellence.


oliver
New User

Sep 20, 2005, 2:08 PM

Post #24 of 25 (7074 views)
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Re: [a-bear] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
Hi,

Simple, APTN use DVCAM and re-use tapes. I ahve been an editor for Network TV News orgs and we RE-USE tapes!!
Ya have to otherwise it gets way too expensive. We re-used Beta-SP and put tem in Beta SX!! We also did DVCAM but we limited them to 20 recordings. Some had a lot more and showed no signs of problems.

Best advise- DONT mix and match your brands. Stick with Sony as we found them to be the most reliable and the doifferent manufacturers have different lubricants which can react and couse head clogs.

Some thoughts


DSR-450
Novice


Dec 13, 2005, 2:26 PM

Post #25 of 25 (6413 views)
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Re: [a-bear] Reusing DVCAM tapes? [In reply to] Can't Post
I regularly reuse the large (184 minute) DVCAM tapes. In the 8 or so years I've been doing this (or however long it's been since the DSR-200 first came out), I've never had a problem. I know plenty of collegues that reuse them as well.