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Home: Video University Forums: Wedding & Event Videography:
A or B camera for LAV?

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 8, 2009, 4:45 PM

Post #1 of 18 (1383 views)
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A or B camera for LAV?	Can't Post

Hey Everyone...

LAV on which camera at the ceremony? Also, use of shotgun with that in mind.

Your thoughts and experience please... :)

Frank

DGates
Veteran

Jun 8, 2009, 4:52 PM

Post #2 of 18 (1380 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I guess you're talking about where to put the wireless transmitter to pick up the groom's lav? I'd put it on the camera that is closest so that the signal is stronger.

"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."

--Abraham Lincoln

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 8, 2009, 5:03 PM

Post #3 of 18 (1373 views)
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Re: [DGates] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

True... the signal would be stronger. Thanks!

What about shotgun mics then... does anyone use one in an effort to minimize bad audio on the camera in the center isle? Or do most of you go with the stereo mic that's on that camera?

Frank

KevinShaw
Veteran

Jun 8, 2009, 5:18 PM

Post #4 of 18 (1368 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

I put one lav on the officiant and typically link that to the rear camera, with a second one on the groom going to a side camera which I then use to follow the couple immediately after the ceremony. A third camera picks up ambient sound from a shotgun mic with a suspension mount to minimize camera motor noise, and if time permits I'll place an iRiver or other digital recorder near musicians and/or on the reader's podium.

One wireless mic isn't enough for two reasons: it's better to cover multiple sources and you need a backup in case your first kit fails.

P.S. Make sure to always use fresh batteries! Blush

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 8, 2009, 5:31 PM

Post #5 of 18 (1365 views)
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Re: [KevinShaw] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks Kevin...

I like the two lav suggestion as well as the portable digital recorder ... and the fresh battery tip... Smile

Observation... looks like another $900 is going out.

One more question... when do I start to make some money... Tongue

Thanks

Frank

Kenneth
Veteran

Jun 8, 2009, 5:54 PM

Post #6 of 18 (1357 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

If I had only two camera and one wireless mic I would put it on the center camera. The sound that the center or balcony camera captures is usually crap. You can't use that for the officiant at all. Even the front camera doesn't always get good audio, but it's usually a lot closer to the sound system speakers than the center cam.

For me I decided to do all off-camera audio for my weddings. I have 4 Sennheisers and an Edirol R-44. I mic the officiant, groom, podium and musicians. If the officiant refuses to wear a mic I will put his mic on the altar stone so we can hear him when he prepares the eucharist.

All the receivers are in a laptop bag so they can be put very close to the transmitters without being seen.

I also put a Zoom H2, voice recorder on the sound system speakers as a back up.

Philadelphia Wedding Video
The Kenneth Stillman Blog

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 8, 2009, 6:22 PM

Post #7 of 18 (1350 views)
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Re: [Kenneth] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Nice control... sounds good Kenneth. The LAVS... is that a 4 unit matching set?

Kenneth
Veteran

Jun 8, 2009, 6:38 PM

Post #8 of 18 (1344 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

yes, 2 A channels and 2 B channels.

Philadelphia Wedding Video
The Kenneth Stillman Blog

Mark Foley
Veteran

Jun 14, 2009, 6:04 AM

Post #9 of 18 (1253 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Quote

when do I start to make some money...

in wedding video...never.... Crazy

_________________________
Mark

Brackish
Veteran

Jun 14, 2009, 11:33 AM

Post #10 of 18 (1220 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

when do I start to make some money...

Is this a business to you or a hobby? The hobbiest looks at gear
as "toys" as in "I got a new toy". The businessman looks at gear
as "tools" as in "if I purchase this new tool it will help me to
raise my prices by $X and will be paid off in X years". Or ... "if
I acquire this tool it really won't help me to get any more for
my videos so best not to purchase it".

------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 14, 2009, 2:18 PM

Post #11 of 18 (1206 views)
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Re: [Brackish] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Howdy...

I'm talking about tools. I want every aspect of the movie to be the best it can be. Audio is a KEY component. I started with a single LAV... that's not cutting it for me. I need good audio in all areas i.e. readings, interviews, etc...

My list of I need more tools continues to grow as my business grows. The money just isn't coming in fast enough to get everything I need. This year was make our name known. That is well on it's way, but like I said... I want our product to be the best it can be.

This Forum is a tools as well. I truly appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions. I take what I do serious. We only have one chance to do our job. I'm the son of a carpenter... you need the right tools to get the job done the correct way.

I should mention... this to me is more than a money making venture. It's also a creative outlet and it's making lasting memories for many.

Thanks for your comments Brackisy

Brackish
Veteran

Jun 14, 2009, 11:37 PM

Post #12 of 18 (1192 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Thanks for your comments Brackish

You're pretty new around here, aren't you?

Were you lurking for some time?

Are you newer to the business or just to VU?

As far as which cam to run the lav to ... I always liked to run
it to a manned cam where the cameraman is monitoring the
audio with headphones, adjusting the levels in manual mode
and just generally making sure the setup is up and running
properly. A huge advantage to wireless over the small digital
recorders is that you can monitor the recording remotely
(at your camera), adjusting levels with the cam in manual audio
mode, making sure there are no problems like bad batteries,
wire come unplugged, subject messing with it, forgot to turn
it on, bad cable, lav mic head with loose wiring connection etc. etc.
Wireless is a much more secure, foolproof way of
going about making important recordings when you need to know
all is working. I think this "run it to the nearest cam" is not
a big concern, especially with a nicer wireless system.

The very next thing you need to plan even before you think about
what you're going to do with the podium and musicians and such
is to think about (and implement) a backup to your vows
recording. The vows is THE NUMBER ONE MOST IMPORTANT
audio recording of the whole day. You have to have a backup
considering that, if you don't get it, you are SCREWED no matter
how well the rest of the video turns out. Get your backup vows
setup in place as a priority over any other audio acquisition.

------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"

smithvideo
Veteran

Jun 16, 2009, 8:18 AM

Post #13 of 18 (1155 views)
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Re: [Brackish] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

when do I start to make some money...

Words of wisdom! Although, there are many where this is "supposed to be" a business, but they get caught up in the hobby "get a new toy" trap! Cool

Reelmoments
Enthusiast

Jun 19, 2009, 1:22 AM

Post #14 of 18 (1085 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

For two cameras I use 5 Mics - I maximize my channels

Camera 1

Channel 1 Podium/Shotgun
Channel 2 Officianet/Shotgun

(The shotgun is re-routable to either channel - so it's the same mic) - The podium and the officient are usually not on at the same time - so i always make sure my shotgun is on at least 1 channel just in case a wireless fails

Camera 2

Channel 1 Shotgun
Channel 2 Groom

The reason why i put the groom on camera 2 is that my camera 2 is not rolling the whole time - my camera 1 is - so the offficient is always on since his audio comprisies of 98% of the video - camera 2 IS on for the the vows - so i just re-sync them l8r
_______________________________________
Eric S. Model
www.reelmoments.com

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 19, 2009, 6:53 PM

Post #15 of 18 (1054 views)
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Re: [Reelmoments] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Guys...

I need more equipment and quick. My part time business is growing faster than I can afford the equipment I need. I know I'm lacking with, I need to act and soon.

Thanks for the pointers

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 19, 2009, 9:21 PM

Post #16 of 18 (1043 views)
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Re: [Brackish] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks Brackish!

New, pretty much so. I started shooting last year. Helped a couple guys out, made my B-Roll demos... picked up some jobs on my own... I think I'm pretty good at making good cuts, I focus on the details and most like my work. My son shoots with me now. I have him flying a glidecam... we're going for a cinematic look. It's starting to come together too.

I'm hurting for equipment. I know I'm lacking in audio and it's driving me nuts. What do you recommend for a reliable VOWS backup system?

Regarding manual vs auto for audio ... I've been getting mixed opinions on that. I was using manual, but of late I've tested my levels and auto has been working pretty good for the Vows... I hate the rustling sound I get sometimes with frigidity grooms... any recommendations for the best place to attach the lav on the groom (Vest, Lapel)?

Oh, BTW... I hate the novice tag... LOL

Frank

Brackish
Veteran

Jun 22, 2009, 3:49 PM

Post #17 of 18 (973 views)
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Re: [fgiardina] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

In Reply To

Thanks Brackish!
What do you recommend for a reliable VOWS backup system?

Probably about the cheapest setup would be an iRiver. For my
tastes it's a little fat to put in a pocket but some people do do it.
Probably could be attached to a belt so as to avoid the pocket
bulge. The iRiver setup is in the $100 range. Would probably
have to buy used from a VUer or ebay.

Next up in price (in the $200 range) would be something like the
Olympus voice recorders or Yamaha Pocketrak. I personally have never
used these devices so can't comment.

http://www.olympusamerica.com/...g_voicerecorders.asp

http://www.yamaha.com/...7101&CTID=228500

Next up in price you're looking at another wireless or quality small
digital recorder. This would be in the $300-$400 range.
Edirol R09 and Marantz PMD620 are some of the recorders.
A lot of this stuff gets discussed over in the VU audio forum.
Michael L. is The Man who knows a lot about these and
has personal experience with many/most.

Personally, one of my biggest concerns would be how fat the device
is if you plan to go with pocket placement rather than hooked
to a belt. An iRiver is a hair over 1" thick and that's pushing
it for my tastes.

------------------------------------------------------------
"still motion is who everyone else is trying to be like"

fgiardina
Novice

Jun 22, 2009, 5:24 PM

Post #18 of 18 (948 views)
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Re: [Brackish] A or B camera for LAV? [In reply to]	Can't Post

Thanks Man!

That backup system is on my short list of things I need.

Well... you guys scared me into fix the audio quick land. I have one single wireless lav I purchased last summer. As much as I'd like to purchase a matching set right now, I decided to go with another wireless lav and a shotgun right away ... I'll go for the podium with one lav the groom the other, as the grooms lav picks up the officiant pretty. With that in mind here's what I'm thinking.

Run a lav out of one channel the shotgun out of the other on my A Camera center.
The second lav on my B Camera.

My initial thought is to have the grooms lav and shotgun on the same A Camera. The second lav on the podium for readings and the sermon. I can always double the vows audio for stereo.

Am I in the ballpark with this thought process?

Frank